request

may we have an indigenous people's category?
or can you advise where i can start posting info
specifically of native american origin?
i get confused sometimes.....

great idea wine hippie sister........

done......

in the solution section.........indigenous wisdom.......

.......

if there are threads to be moved let me know........

ok, but the guidstones post may have NWO implications
(just a hunch) and is not from an indigenous tribe,,,,,,

i have some tribal posts and thank you so much
for the section, will begin soon.....

sorry...i didn´t actually read the guide stone post yet sorry.....was going by the title........my bad........ you are correct and moved it back to general discussion.........

i´m half asleep and stopped here on my way to bed........

ah hunny bunny, get some sleep
dream wonderful dreams
i love ya, sister zuni gurl

WineHippie wrote:

may we have an indigenous people's category?
or can you advise where i can start posting info
specifically of native american origin?
i get confused sometimes.....

Sounds good.

But I thought 'Native' Americans migrated from Russia over the Bering Sea bridge...

So there are no indigenous people in America

nogroz wrote:

But I thought 'Native' Americans migrated from Russia over the Bering Sea bridge...

So there are no indigenous people in America

A simple, persuasive, once might even say seductive, story - several small bands of nomadic big-game hunters from Siberia colonizing a virgin land and over thousands of years their descendants would spread to every corner of the Americas and give rise to most of the native people in the Americas today. This was (and for many archaeologists it still IS) the gospel of American archaeology.

BUT ....

(and this but's for you, nodoz)

it now seems that this scenario is much too simple. All across the Americas, archaeologists and anthropologists, along with geneticists, linguists, geologists, and some of America's native peoples, are assembling new data, reassessing older data, and generating new models that call into question both the single genetic and cultural origin model as well as the Clovis First model. And the answers now emerging to the questions of who were the First Americans, from where did they come, how did they get to the Americas, when did they arrive in the Americas, and what were their lifeways during initial colonization are very different from those of just a few years ago and suggest a picture very different from the standard textbook story of Who the First Americans were.


WHO were the FIRST Americans?
The accumulating skeletal and genetic evidence suggests that the earliest populations to move into the Americas were not Asians whose primary genetic background was that of residents of northeastern Asia and eastern Mongolia (the old view). At the end of 1999 scientists meet in California and New Mexico to mull over the implications of recently discovered or restudied ancient American skeletons, most of which date between 8,600 and 11,000 years ago. And what they discovered has shaken the foundations of the anthropological communities. Instead of resembling the historically known American Indians, the wide range of skull shapes which have come to light so far display affinities with populations as diverse as the Ainu of Japan, peoples of central Asia, Australasia, India, southwest Asia, even the Neandertals of Europe (see Ancestors of the New World Had Multiple Origins for more information about the possible Neandertal connection). Genetic evidence also supports the idea of multiple migrations of people coming from distinctly different genetic poplations: perhaps as many as four or five different genetic populations. For an idea of what some of these earliest Americans may have looked like, go here.

HOW did they GET TO the Americas?
While some populations, perhaps the genetic and cultural forbears of the Clovis people, walked across the "land bridge" and down the ice-free corridor in western Canada, some theorists are beginning to consider the possibility that people migrated to the Americas by walking or boating along the now submerged Beringia and the continental shelves of North, Central, and South America. While older ideas stressed that the late Ice-Age glaciers extended down and into the Pacific ocean, newer studies have shown that this was not the case. Indeed, even our ideas about the environment of the entire "land bridge" have changed markedly in the last several decades. Perhaps the "ice-free" corridor was along the Pacific coast of the Americas, which would help explain why some of the oldest sites in the Americas are in South, not North America. Other scientists have proposed a migration of boat people from Europe, basing their hypothesis on what they perceive as shared technologies and tool types between Clovis and Solutrean people who lived in France around 18,000 years ago. Presumably, European boat people would have used much the same route that the Norse (Vikings) did thousands or years later (around 1,100 years ago), when they settled in Iceland, Greenland, Newfoundland, and the northeastern U.S.

WHEN did they ARRIVE?
Archaeological evidence suggests that people were already living in the Americas well before the initial appearance of Clovis. For example, people were living at a site called Monte Verde (in Chile) at least 12,500 years ago (and perhaps as much as 30,000-plus years ago). AT some point after the inhabitants left the site, rising creek waters covered the site, laying down a deposit of peat which preserved a wide range of items: animal bones, wood planks, stakes, and animals used to cover rectangular shaped living structures, fireplace ash, a human footprint, and the remains of over 70 kinds of edible plants. At Meadowcroft Rock Shelter, in western Pennsylvannia, there is evidence of nearly continuous human occupation from the Iroquoian Seneca of the early centuries of English and American occupation all the way back to Clovis and beyond. The site's excavator, Dr. James Adovasio, claims he has human-made fire pits dating to more than 14,000 years ago, with indications of some being as old as 17,000 years.A battery of radiocarbon dates puts people at this creekside campsite in south-central Chile around 12,500 years ago.

WHAT were their LIFEWAYS.
Varied and diverse subsistence practices (and by extension, varied and diverse technologies and tools). If the Clovis people (and their immediate genetic and cultural ancestors) came through an "ice-free corridor" and emerged onto the great plains of North America, their subsistence in all probability centered on the taking of mega-fauna, supplimented by familiar plant foods. For those folks who entered the Americas along the Pacific coast, either on foot or by coastal boating, food resources would have run the gamut from shellfish to fish to birds and birds' eggs to sea mammals, plus those plant species which were widely distributed along the coast and with which the pioneering people were well familiar.

So.... nice research...


Now out of all that then WHO is the iindigenous race?

Nearly all of today's Native Americans in North, Central, and South America can trace part of their ancestry to six women whose descendants immigrated around 20,000 years ago, a DNA study suggests.

Those women left a particular DNA legacy that persists to today in about about 95 percent of Native Americans, researchers said.

The finding does not mean that only these six women gave rise to the migrants who crossed into North America from Asia in the initial populating of the continent, said study co-author Ugo Perego.

The women lived between 18,000 and 21,000 years ago, though not necessarily at exactly the same time, he said.

The work was published this week by the journal PLoS One. Perego is from the Sorenson Molecular Genealogy Foundation in Salt Lake City and the University of Pavia in Italy.

The work confirms previous indications of the six maternal lineages, he said. But an expert unconnected with the study said the findings left some questions unanswered.

(Explore a human migration timeline.)

Maternal Lines

Perego and his colleagues traced the history of a particular kind of DNA that represents just a tiny fraction of the human genetic material and reflects only a piece of a person's ancestry.

This DNA is found in the mitochondria, the power plants of cells. Unlike the DNA found in the nucleus, mitochondrial DNA is passed along only by the mother. So it follows a lineage that connects a person to his or her mother, then the mother's mother, and so on.

The researchers created a "family tree" that traces the different mitochondrial DNA lineages found in today's Native Americans. By noting mutations in each branch and applying a formula for how often such mutations arise, they calculated how old each branch was. That indicated when each branch arose in a single woman.

The six "founding mothers" apparently did not live in Asia because the DNA signatures they left behind aren't found there, Perego said. They probably lived in Beringia, the now-submerged land bridge that stretched to North America, he said.

(Related story: New World Settlers Took 20,000-Year Pit Stop [February 14, 2008])

"An OK Number to Start With"

Connie Mulligan of the University of Florida, an anthropolgist who studies the colonization of the Americas but didn't participate in the new work, said it's not surprising to trace the mitochondrial DNA to six women. "It's an OK number to start with right now," but further work may change it slightly, she said.

That finding doesn't answer the bigger questions of where those women lived, or of how many people left Beringia to colonize the Americas, she said Thursday.

The estimate for when the women lived is open to question because it's not clear whether the researchers properly accounted for differing mutation rates in mitochondrial DNA, she said. Further work could change the estimate, "possibly dramatically," she said.

here's one for you to chew on, nodoz:

This is a bad time if you want certainty about the first Americans but a good time if you like informed mystery. Discoveries in the past decade have cast old concepts in doubt, while others haven't fully developed to take their place. Just enough new information has come to light to enchant the mind with alternative theories, but it's not solid enough to eliminate the old ones. We have entered a period of widespread questioning.

source